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brij523
02-13 09:10 AM
Chanduv,
I know in the past many times it was debated -- why people do not support? Let me put forth what I feel.
Effort put by IV is very commendable. But the beneficiary of IV work (mostly) do not give importance to Green Card. That is what I think based on talking to multiple people and that is what we see from the % participation of people for various fruitful effort put forth by IV. Most of them say they do not care if they get GC or not. In their heart of heart they may but not too much.
Other reason I can think of is -- There could be doubt in minds of many people of IV strength. The day IV gets some success, people will rally behind IV for a while. And that is the scenario outside world too. See the stock price. If the company is doing good, stock price goes up. The day one bad news comes, stocks falls down. Take the presidential election. You can very well make out that contribution by company or people is proportional to candidate wins. If you are loosing, contribution will dry out very fast. I am not saying that candidate will not have supporter but that would be less in number. Take N.T. Rama Rao case. The day Naidu ditched him and others followed him, no officials gave importance to NTR.
Believe me, in my office or outside, I have talked to every Indian. And not one comes back n discusses with me about IV.
I strongly feel IV is doing a commendable job with some dedicated contributors.
IV in past has looked into all options. It is not possible to sue USCIS because the law protects them for what they are doing. they are following the law.
If people think we have a case, please take initiative and lead this - you will know how ready the community is. All those who are talking big here on this thread will run away u will see them running 180 degrees the other side if you ask them to come for the class action.
We are not able to generate enough letters - people tend to be rude when asked to sign letters and fight us finding fault with us.
The only way we can achieve something is if we unite and that has to happen through community building exercises and inculcating a sense for the community in the people.
I am ready to support this initiative if it is feasable - so please do not get me wrong or think that I am pessimist. The ckind of community we are dealing with, things are not that easy that we open a thread on IV and everyone follow it.
How many sent flowers? Close to 300
How many attended rally? - close to 2000
How many sending letters ? - close to 2000
All this after so much of cajoling and motivating. needhelp and gang working tirelessly trying hard to get signatures, standing outside grocery stores, standing in train stations, being so focussed - why can others not see what they are doing? The only way our community is going to succeed is by more people coming forward and complimenting efforts of needhelp and and this must keep increasing.
Is the community ready to stand up and rise in unity? Or just opening threads and discussing anonymously and then burying the threads deep below?
Can we walk the talk?
I know in the past many times it was debated -- why people do not support? Let me put forth what I feel.
Effort put by IV is very commendable. But the beneficiary of IV work (mostly) do not give importance to Green Card. That is what I think based on talking to multiple people and that is what we see from the % participation of people for various fruitful effort put forth by IV. Most of them say they do not care if they get GC or not. In their heart of heart they may but not too much.
Other reason I can think of is -- There could be doubt in minds of many people of IV strength. The day IV gets some success, people will rally behind IV for a while. And that is the scenario outside world too. See the stock price. If the company is doing good, stock price goes up. The day one bad news comes, stocks falls down. Take the presidential election. You can very well make out that contribution by company or people is proportional to candidate wins. If you are loosing, contribution will dry out very fast. I am not saying that candidate will not have supporter but that would be less in number. Take N.T. Rama Rao case. The day Naidu ditched him and others followed him, no officials gave importance to NTR.
Believe me, in my office or outside, I have talked to every Indian. And not one comes back n discusses with me about IV.
I strongly feel IV is doing a commendable job with some dedicated contributors.
IV in past has looked into all options. It is not possible to sue USCIS because the law protects them for what they are doing. they are following the law.
If people think we have a case, please take initiative and lead this - you will know how ready the community is. All those who are talking big here on this thread will run away u will see them running 180 degrees the other side if you ask them to come for the class action.
We are not able to generate enough letters - people tend to be rude when asked to sign letters and fight us finding fault with us.
The only way we can achieve something is if we unite and that has to happen through community building exercises and inculcating a sense for the community in the people.
I am ready to support this initiative if it is feasable - so please do not get me wrong or think that I am pessimist. The ckind of community we are dealing with, things are not that easy that we open a thread on IV and everyone follow it.
How many sent flowers? Close to 300
How many attended rally? - close to 2000
How many sending letters ? - close to 2000
All this after so much of cajoling and motivating. needhelp and gang working tirelessly trying hard to get signatures, standing outside grocery stores, standing in train stations, being so focussed - why can others not see what they are doing? The only way our community is going to succeed is by more people coming forward and complimenting efforts of needhelp and and this must keep increasing.
Is the community ready to stand up and rise in unity? Or just opening threads and discussing anonymously and then burying the threads deep below?
Can we walk the talk?
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reddymjm
09-23 04:35 PM
One thing, assume if it works out and 50% of the people are able to buy houses and get the GC, they are out of the queue right, so automatically the back logs are gone and the remaining people not able to buy the house will get benifited.
I am waiting for my GC to buy a house.
I am waiting for my GC to buy a house.
hebbar77
09-04 04:06 PM
Please contribute to IV before start collection for political party. Thanks
I will donate to IV if I believe it made a different to my GC process.
I will donate to IV if I believe it made a different to my GC process.
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senthil1
02-13 09:11 AM
I think unused other country quota is used for oversubscribed countries like India and china in the last quarter. If that is true then even removing country quota will not make much difference for Eb3. Now waiting time is 7 years. It will be 5 years for all the countries. When they remove country quota persons from countries like Europe may lose interest in applying gc as they may think is not worth for them to apply and wait 5 years or more as there is not much difference in lifestyle between US and Europe. I doubt US will remove country cap. But we never know as world changes fast nowadays.Anyhow country quota is not correct and it is similar to reservation in India. If reservation concept is correct then country quota is correct as every country in world get benefit.
Ethnicity has nothing to do with skill level. Consider this also, if no other countries come close to the 7% limit, but India and China are maxed out. Guess who loses just because of an arbitrary limit? Guess where those unused greencards go?
They go to a pile of greencards, left unused and wasted. Wash, rinse, repeat the same cycle year on year. June 07 will be a looooooong way away (if you are from a severely retrogressed country), don't kid yourself.
btw... i was agreeing with abhijitp.
Ethnicity has nothing to do with skill level. Consider this also, if no other countries come close to the 7% limit, but India and China are maxed out. Guess who loses just because of an arbitrary limit? Guess where those unused greencards go?
They go to a pile of greencards, left unused and wasted. Wash, rinse, repeat the same cycle year on year. June 07 will be a looooooong way away (if you are from a severely retrogressed country), don't kid yourself.
btw... i was agreeing with abhijitp.
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addsf345
05-29 04:22 PM
We all need to concentrate on being united. No point in pulling down others. This is typical behavior of Indian attitude. Do you think you will get your GC faster if EB1 abuse stops??? I would say no, we would be still stuck in the same shit hole for another 10 years. Why waste energy on this??? We should rather work on more constructive action items.
Our main problem is 7% quota for India, China and other retrogressed countries is simply not enough. We need some relief in any possible way.
Sometime back i did suggest an idea of working towards a separate Quota (not counted towards 140,000) for Masters/PhD students. That horse was beaten to death.
Lets think more positive and list down all actions that we could work.
To start with i suggest on having a separate quota (not counted towards 140,000) for Masters/PhD students. That should ease most of the pain.
If anybody has other bright ideas, feel free
Channel your outrage on a positive action item
still ppl feel pulling others lag would get them GC - this commnity can never be united!:confused:
Our main problem is 7% quota for India, China and other retrogressed countries is simply not enough. We need some relief in any possible way.
Sometime back i did suggest an idea of working towards a separate Quota (not counted towards 140,000) for Masters/PhD students. That horse was beaten to death.
Lets think more positive and list down all actions that we could work.
To start with i suggest on having a separate quota (not counted towards 140,000) for Masters/PhD students. That should ease most of the pain.
If anybody has other bright ideas, feel free
Channel your outrage on a positive action item
still ppl feel pulling others lag would get them GC - this commnity can never be united!:confused:
unitednations
02-14 04:00 PM
The entire discussion by EB3-ROW guys want to preserve those recaptured unused numbers in 2000 only for EB3-ROW for ever. As I mentioned earlier, the purpose of that recapture is to eliminate backlog in 1999. India and China were only the two countries backlogged at that point. USCIS could do that job only in 2005. You guys want a controlled allocation of recaptured numbers for years and years with the simple intension of EB3-ROW always should be current. I understand that urge. However, you guys forget the reality. EB3 demand is huge due to 245i. The real demand for EB2 always very less. (The real demand for EB2 is when EB3 were current). Now everyone is going to EB2. I feel that is the reason why EB2-India and China getting penalized as DOS took the law in their own hand. Now EB2 guys are victimized. Do not blame India and China took more numbers. The real fact is EB3-ROW is enjoying with the expense of EB2.
Furthermore all this mess is due cumulative results allowing 245i without increasing visa numbers (this is major one), failure of DOL in processing LC in time, USCIS inefficiency, dealy in processing 485 due to 911, abuse in labor substitution, abuse of massive filing of GC by body shoppers with out a bonafide permanent positions or ability to pay, opening a firms in fast labor processing states just to file GC etc. The list for this mess is end less. No one wants to fix that. If they fix everything, there will be less demand for EB3 visas. Furthermore some thing can not be fixed. One can not request/litigate DOL or USCIS to process the LC or 485 fast. Therefore, everyone in EB3 has to wait. Other option is to educate the law makers the problems due to this mess to fix those. Everyone wants CIR/SKIL bill and no one wants to fix the current system and abuse. So, one has to wait, wait, wait..
I have come across many people in the last few years from all sorts of countries. Russian, Korean, African, British, Brazilian, Colombian, etc,; although everyone wants their greencards yesterday; it appears to me that the indian nationals are the most hungry for it. It is a generalization but I am just speaking from my experience on this.
How do you know what the "intention" was of the lawmakers that recaptured visas are supposed to go to the retrogressed countries. If that was the case they would have gotten rid of the 7% limitation along with the recapture.
Most people who come on h-1b are Chines and indian. There was also close to 200,000 visitor visas approved in 2005 from India. Makes sense because there is a lot of population there. However; it would be short sited to think that there are minimal 245i applicants from India. There actually is a very large number of them. The biggest status violators are people who come on visitor visas from non visa waiver countries. The status violators either get greencard through marriage or through 245i.
Although as a business person I look at skill rather then nationality; I do know enough about immigration that there is a good purpose behind country limits. Foreign nationals will prefer their own people for h-1b; they will look for their friends, cousins, brothers, sisters, wives, relatives, etc. and bring their own country people here. Therefore, it is not an "open market" on skill people from all parts of the world. The country quota is the equalizer because of this.
The cultural aspect of south asians is also hurting retrogression. Most people who come here on H-1b are out of school and generally single. People from non south asian countries or muslim countries will find their spouse here. However, someone on h-1b from south asian country or muslim country will get arranged marriage after being here for 4 to 6 years and then spouse gets counted against the quota at the expense of a skilled worker who may have had a later date. I a m not saying this is wrong because it is a cultural issue but is confined to certain countries.
Regarding eb2 and eb3. This is also something that is quite comical. This is an area where immigration law hasn't kept up business practices. Pre H-1b you got greencard upon initial entry into USA. Department of labor rules were that you couldn't use the experience gained by your sponsor. It was never envisioned that people would come here on h-1b and hop/skip between employers. It has caused an end run around what the DOL rules were supposed to be. You shouldn't be able to gain experience in USA and then use that unfair advantage to knock out an american for that job. EB2 and EB3 differentiation would go away if you couldn't use the experience gained in USA. Just about everyone would be in eb3. Anyone who is here on h-1b generally already has or will have 5 years of experience and can go right to eb2.
People who are working at companies which aren't dominated by immigrants would have a difficult time satisfying themselves that the job requires a bachelors degree plus five years or masters degree. However; if you work at a staffing company you go straight to eb2 because that is what is needed to keep you there (remember, it is supposed to be the minimum requirements for the job). If software engineer or programmer analyst minimum requirement is masters or bachelors plus five then company is saying that is the "minimum" job requirements. However, if it is the "minimum" requirements then how are companies getting people here on h-1b who only have a bachelors degree?
Although people like to say "immigration system is broken" it can mean two things. From greencard wannabes; it is too much red tape, not friendly enough, etc. From other side it is broken because it is not being used as its intended purpose. You can mark my words that if/when rules are relaxed on h-1b or quota; you will see a whole bunch of enforcement with it. It actually is already happening at the consulates; department of labor and revocations of 140's by companies who are sponsoring too many people.
Furthermore all this mess is due cumulative results allowing 245i without increasing visa numbers (this is major one), failure of DOL in processing LC in time, USCIS inefficiency, dealy in processing 485 due to 911, abuse in labor substitution, abuse of massive filing of GC by body shoppers with out a bonafide permanent positions or ability to pay, opening a firms in fast labor processing states just to file GC etc. The list for this mess is end less. No one wants to fix that. If they fix everything, there will be less demand for EB3 visas. Furthermore some thing can not be fixed. One can not request/litigate DOL or USCIS to process the LC or 485 fast. Therefore, everyone in EB3 has to wait. Other option is to educate the law makers the problems due to this mess to fix those. Everyone wants CIR/SKIL bill and no one wants to fix the current system and abuse. So, one has to wait, wait, wait..
I have come across many people in the last few years from all sorts of countries. Russian, Korean, African, British, Brazilian, Colombian, etc,; although everyone wants their greencards yesterday; it appears to me that the indian nationals are the most hungry for it. It is a generalization but I am just speaking from my experience on this.
How do you know what the "intention" was of the lawmakers that recaptured visas are supposed to go to the retrogressed countries. If that was the case they would have gotten rid of the 7% limitation along with the recapture.
Most people who come on h-1b are Chines and indian. There was also close to 200,000 visitor visas approved in 2005 from India. Makes sense because there is a lot of population there. However; it would be short sited to think that there are minimal 245i applicants from India. There actually is a very large number of them. The biggest status violators are people who come on visitor visas from non visa waiver countries. The status violators either get greencard through marriage or through 245i.
Although as a business person I look at skill rather then nationality; I do know enough about immigration that there is a good purpose behind country limits. Foreign nationals will prefer their own people for h-1b; they will look for their friends, cousins, brothers, sisters, wives, relatives, etc. and bring their own country people here. Therefore, it is not an "open market" on skill people from all parts of the world. The country quota is the equalizer because of this.
The cultural aspect of south asians is also hurting retrogression. Most people who come here on H-1b are out of school and generally single. People from non south asian countries or muslim countries will find their spouse here. However, someone on h-1b from south asian country or muslim country will get arranged marriage after being here for 4 to 6 years and then spouse gets counted against the quota at the expense of a skilled worker who may have had a later date. I a m not saying this is wrong because it is a cultural issue but is confined to certain countries.
Regarding eb2 and eb3. This is also something that is quite comical. This is an area where immigration law hasn't kept up business practices. Pre H-1b you got greencard upon initial entry into USA. Department of labor rules were that you couldn't use the experience gained by your sponsor. It was never envisioned that people would come here on h-1b and hop/skip between employers. It has caused an end run around what the DOL rules were supposed to be. You shouldn't be able to gain experience in USA and then use that unfair advantage to knock out an american for that job. EB2 and EB3 differentiation would go away if you couldn't use the experience gained in USA. Just about everyone would be in eb3. Anyone who is here on h-1b generally already has or will have 5 years of experience and can go right to eb2.
People who are working at companies which aren't dominated by immigrants would have a difficult time satisfying themselves that the job requires a bachelors degree plus five years or masters degree. However; if you work at a staffing company you go straight to eb2 because that is what is needed to keep you there (remember, it is supposed to be the minimum requirements for the job). If software engineer or programmer analyst minimum requirement is masters or bachelors plus five then company is saying that is the "minimum" job requirements. However, if it is the "minimum" requirements then how are companies getting people here on h-1b who only have a bachelors degree?
Although people like to say "immigration system is broken" it can mean two things. From greencard wannabes; it is too much red tape, not friendly enough, etc. From other side it is broken because it is not being used as its intended purpose. You can mark my words that if/when rules are relaxed on h-1b or quota; you will see a whole bunch of enforcement with it. It actually is already happening at the consulates; department of labor and revocations of 140's by companies who are sponsoring too many people.
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justAnotherFile
06-28 08:10 PM
As per Macaca's logic, pre Oct 2005 PDs will take up all the numbers available for EB2 Indai for 2007, in June and July.
If that is the case why was the Bulletin for july not set to Oct or Nov 2005 and instead made current. Surely USCIS does not want to deal with all the extra workload if it does not have to.
If that is the case why was the Bulletin for july not set to Oct or Nov 2005 and instead made current. Surely USCIS does not want to deal with all the extra workload if it does not have to.
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unitednations
02-18 10:36 PM
In fact I guess most of the April 2001 245(i) cases are also getting through the Eb3 category...I thought that they would get into the EB3 Other workers category with the 10000 K cap........ I guess many of the cases you are referring to must be the 245(i) cases...
As I remember, even when I came to US the first time in 2000, I was interviewed quite rigorously...They made me submit degree certificate and experience certificates and all...
Cooks and driving instructors getting in on H1B??? That is news to me...
Yeah, they are all 245i. If they aren't in USA; they can't get here on h-1b; job needs a degree. My point was that when people try to contrast family base with eb and which one is better; people would be surprised to know that people in family base generally would fall into definition of skilled worker and share same quota as eb3 professional but would have to wait outside usa since they wouldn't qualify for any temporary non immigrant visas.
As I remember, even when I came to US the first time in 2000, I was interviewed quite rigorously...They made me submit degree certificate and experience certificates and all...
Cooks and driving instructors getting in on H1B??? That is news to me...
Yeah, they are all 245i. If they aren't in USA; they can't get here on h-1b; job needs a degree. My point was that when people try to contrast family base with eb and which one is better; people would be surprised to know that people in family base generally would fall into definition of skilled worker and share same quota as eb3 professional but would have to wait outside usa since they wouldn't qualify for any temporary non immigrant visas.
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angelfire76
06-13 06:26 AM
Who cares if dilipcr is from BITS or some Swami PavBhaji university in Arnakulam. All are same in America. For your Greencard application you just need a minimum degree that can be acceptable by USCIS. For jobs and career, your Indian degree is nothing. It only boosts your ego and you can tell your Indian friends. If you tell your American friends they will just laugh at your ignorance. If you are so attached to your BITS then how about you go and help them be #1? It is your caliber and performance that matters in jobs. IIT and IIMs can be successful in USA or misfits same as people from third rate colleges in India. I have seen people from APTech and NIIT do better than graduates of US of top Indian colleges. So stop having a false pride. This false pride is only good for getting you married via an arranged marriage to an Indian girl in India. Nothing more than that.
That statement was ridculously funny :D BTW, Mr Dilip, a classmate of mine from graduate school who did his Ph.d in Cryptography, couple of internships in RSA, was ranked #5 in the Math Olympiad in 1993 had to return to India because most of the jobs he applied for required security clearance, which means USC. He's now a successful head of the computer science dept. in Mumbai and the feedback from his students about his knowledge is amazing.
Most people who came during the 1995-2001 were HTML and Cobol junkies who got lucky when their GCs were issued. Take your arguments some place else. :rolleyes:
That statement was ridculously funny :D BTW, Mr Dilip, a classmate of mine from graduate school who did his Ph.d in Cryptography, couple of internships in RSA, was ranked #5 in the Math Olympiad in 1993 had to return to India because most of the jobs he applied for required security clearance, which means USC. He's now a successful head of the computer science dept. in Mumbai and the feedback from his students about his knowledge is amazing.
Most people who came during the 1995-2001 were HTML and Cobol junkies who got lucky when their GCs were issued. Take your arguments some place else. :rolleyes:
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GCDream
07-03 08:40 PM
Dugg 159
http://digg.com/politics/No_July_4th_Celebrations_for_Highly_Skilled_Future _Americans/who
Comment also added
http://digg.com/politics/No_July_4th_Celebrations_for_Highly_Skilled_Future _Americans/who
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chanduv23
02-13 06:27 PM
hopefulgc - please dedicate some time and update your first post with more information on lawsuit, you may want to quote lazycis 's posts and other information.
A lot of people may not be very knowledgable and may backoff when they see the word "lawsuit".
Those who are saying YES on the poll - it is assumed that you will not backoff - if you have not yet updated your profile on IV - please update your complete profile - this will show that you can be counted on.
A lot of people may not be very knowledgable and may backoff when they see the word "lawsuit".
Those who are saying YES on the poll - it is assumed that you will not backoff - if you have not yet updated your profile on IV - please update your complete profile - this will show that you can be counted on.
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acecupid
08-15 10:22 AM
Collin Powell incident is America's problem. Even after the civil rights movement and equality to Blacks, they are still having discrimination. Just ask Black people in America and how they feel in their daily life.
So according to you by coming to America we should forget India because you will call us traitor? Have you heard how Jews in America are so strong and care for Israel even after becoming US citizens?
The fact is Indians are responsible for their own problems and greencard woes. They want to live in this sorry state and blame everyone else around them except themselves. They do not have any pride in their roots and thus flee their own country. They do not come to this country for betterment of their skills, education and experience but because they want to flee the country. There maybe exceptions but this is what I have seen in Indians who are on H1B or who have become US Citizens.
Why is your profile info empty ? Have you forgotten your motherland or where you came from ?
So according to you by coming to America we should forget India because you will call us traitor? Have you heard how Jews in America are so strong and care for Israel even after becoming US citizens?
The fact is Indians are responsible for their own problems and greencard woes. They want to live in this sorry state and blame everyone else around them except themselves. They do not have any pride in their roots and thus flee their own country. They do not come to this country for betterment of their skills, education and experience but because they want to flee the country. There maybe exceptions but this is what I have seen in Indians who are on H1B or who have become US Citizens.
Why is your profile info empty ? Have you forgotten your motherland or where you came from ?
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TeddyKoochu
09-15 11:36 AM
Thanks for this useful info. 05 & 06 approved #s in Q-4 of 08 looks very significant - these alongwith approval of 'multiple filed AOS' will surely reduce wait time for 05-EB2i. Hop[efully before june 05 cases will be done.
Friends I believe that we are underestimating the cases that have been abandoned due to the bad economy. Individuals having to back, revocations etc. I estimate that we can chop off at least 25% more just by that on top of the existing deductions / reductions. clearing out of the 2006 batch by Sep 2010 looks really very likely.
Friends I believe that we are underestimating the cases that have been abandoned due to the bad economy. Individuals having to back, revocations etc. I estimate that we can chop off at least 25% more just by that on top of the existing deductions / reductions. clearing out of the 2006 batch by Sep 2010 looks really very likely.
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ivar
08-15 12:23 PM
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gc28262
06-15 04:22 PM
Ivar and group,
...............................
My suggestion here is that let the outsourcers take the hit. They have always benefitted by flouting the rules. If your concern is way too high for your L1 brothers then you would find it prudent to bring in the law that clearly states "Pay high wages for the L1s or dont bring them in here". ..........................................
dilipcr,
Please wake up from your dream. No matter how you want it, outsourcing won't go away.
Outsourcing companies will always provide a lower cost to client as long as dollar is valuable than rupee ( or any other developing world currency).
They can do this by one of the following ways.
Use L1s for client site assignments. Some of these maybe illegal. Still they do it. Client is happy, outsourcers are happy.
Let us say everybody complains to ICE about this and L1 visas are unavailable for outsourcers. Their next strategy is to change the ratio of onsite resources to offshore resources. Again they will offer a cheaper solution to client. For executing a project in onsite/offshore model they don't need all these L1 guys here. They just need a few managers and maybe some team leads. They can execute the project with minumum resources onsite. Company and client wins again. The only reason they place so many resources onsite is to charge the client at dollar rate.
If US wants to prevent offshoring they have to ban offshoring explicitly. Doing so will go against the WTO rules.
To summarize, outsourcing cannot be stopped. Salary levels will always go down with time.
...............................
My suggestion here is that let the outsourcers take the hit. They have always benefitted by flouting the rules. If your concern is way too high for your L1 brothers then you would find it prudent to bring in the law that clearly states "Pay high wages for the L1s or dont bring them in here". ..........................................
dilipcr,
Please wake up from your dream. No matter how you want it, outsourcing won't go away.
Outsourcing companies will always provide a lower cost to client as long as dollar is valuable than rupee ( or any other developing world currency).
They can do this by one of the following ways.
Use L1s for client site assignments. Some of these maybe illegal. Still they do it. Client is happy, outsourcers are happy.
Let us say everybody complains to ICE about this and L1 visas are unavailable for outsourcers. Their next strategy is to change the ratio of onsite resources to offshore resources. Again they will offer a cheaper solution to client. For executing a project in onsite/offshore model they don't need all these L1 guys here. They just need a few managers and maybe some team leads. They can execute the project with minumum resources onsite. Company and client wins again. The only reason they place so many resources onsite is to charge the client at dollar rate.
If US wants to prevent offshoring they have to ban offshoring explicitly. Doing so will go against the WTO rules.
To summarize, outsourcing cannot be stopped. Salary levels will always go down with time.
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grimreaper
07-21 05:16 PM
I have come across quite a few of the Amway/ Quickstart folks. Like most of the people have described here, they usually approach me in Walmart, Meijer, etc. My first experience was in the temple. This dude and his wife went "oh wow! you know so many languages." After talking to the dude, he said that he knew some of my childhood friends and he remembered my face and that we could have possibly played cricket together in our childhood days (this itself should have raised red flags - but I was naive then and didn't think twice). Long story short, we exchanged phone #s and next day he called me and asked me to meet him at his home. He was running an "ecomm business" and was looking for partners. I asked him if he was talking about Amway and he innocently asked me "What is Amway?" I agreed to meet him but something bothered me. I called up another childhood friend who was in Amway and asked him about this dude. Sure enough he was an Amway-ite and already a "Diamond". I was mad and did not go to his house. He called me a couple of times but I never picked up the phone.
That encounter was a bitter experience for me and I decided that I will not entertain any more desis who do cold contacts. However, soon I forgot all about him and I had 2 or 3 more such "cold" contacts (it took me about 3 more experiences to realize the Amyay "cold" contact pattern). I decided that enough was enough. From then on if a desi approached me in any of the stores and decided to do a "cold" contact, I would be on my guard. I would not become angry or irritated (after all they are humans too and they are just doing what they believe will give them a better life) - I would just steer the conversation to what I would like to do in my life. I would spin some yarn about how I am really happy volunteering to help kids in 1st and 2nd grade improve their English reading skills (which I really did) or how I liked taking part in the local community college's adult literacy program (helping adults prepare for GEDs, etc - again which is something I do). I would then go on and become philosophical about how these days everyone is after money and think about money all the time and how this is creating a very unhealthy state of mind, especially among Indians. I would make sure to tell the person that I would not like to go down that path and being a pious Hindu, my goal is to attain Moksha by leading a simple life.
By this time if the dude has not run away from me, I will ask him what his objectives are. Usually they say that they can understand where I am coming from and congratulate me for all my community service (I am rolling all over the place in my head - but somehow keep a straight face). One guy even went so far as to tell me that he is on the other end of the spectrum and he gives away a lot of money in charity. He even told me that I should consider going that route as well. After the meeting, I call up my Amway friend and ask him if XYZ is in Amway and the answer has always been yes.
Inspite of all this if the dude asks for my phone number (and this has happened once), I come up with the story that I forgot to bring my cell phone and proceed to give the person the phone # of the local pharmacy. I also suggest that he give a "missed call" (again rolled all over the place in my head when he gave a missed call) so that I can note down his # when I go home.
I just had to get this off my chest when I saw the Amway thread. Hopefully others can also turn a potentially unpleasant situation into a pleasant situation and have fun at some other person's expense.
Hilarious.....I have not been accosted by any AMWAY members yet, but if I do, I will try to give them a run for their Money. I am just tickled by your attitude. Way to go buddy.....:D
That encounter was a bitter experience for me and I decided that I will not entertain any more desis who do cold contacts. However, soon I forgot all about him and I had 2 or 3 more such "cold" contacts (it took me about 3 more experiences to realize the Amyay "cold" contact pattern). I decided that enough was enough. From then on if a desi approached me in any of the stores and decided to do a "cold" contact, I would be on my guard. I would not become angry or irritated (after all they are humans too and they are just doing what they believe will give them a better life) - I would just steer the conversation to what I would like to do in my life. I would spin some yarn about how I am really happy volunteering to help kids in 1st and 2nd grade improve their English reading skills (which I really did) or how I liked taking part in the local community college's adult literacy program (helping adults prepare for GEDs, etc - again which is something I do). I would then go on and become philosophical about how these days everyone is after money and think about money all the time and how this is creating a very unhealthy state of mind, especially among Indians. I would make sure to tell the person that I would not like to go down that path and being a pious Hindu, my goal is to attain Moksha by leading a simple life.
By this time if the dude has not run away from me, I will ask him what his objectives are. Usually they say that they can understand where I am coming from and congratulate me for all my community service (I am rolling all over the place in my head - but somehow keep a straight face). One guy even went so far as to tell me that he is on the other end of the spectrum and he gives away a lot of money in charity. He even told me that I should consider going that route as well. After the meeting, I call up my Amway friend and ask him if XYZ is in Amway and the answer has always been yes.
Inspite of all this if the dude asks for my phone number (and this has happened once), I come up with the story that I forgot to bring my cell phone and proceed to give the person the phone # of the local pharmacy. I also suggest that he give a "missed call" (again rolled all over the place in my head when he gave a missed call) so that I can note down his # when I go home.
I just had to get this off my chest when I saw the Amway thread. Hopefully others can also turn a potentially unpleasant situation into a pleasant situation and have fun at some other person's expense.
Hilarious.....I have not been accosted by any AMWAY members yet, but if I do, I will try to give them a run for their Money. I am just tickled by your attitude. Way to go buddy.....:D
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sunnymit
07-30 02:37 PM
I met this dude in Secaucus (NJ) Walmart yesterday. I was looking for an ice-cream so he pretended to do the same. Smiled at me once and then just as I was walking away from the ice-cream sections comes over with a very nice hello. Started talking to me "as they always do" but I think this time he forgot where he was. First asked me "Do you know where is a Walmart around here?", quickly realized he is in one right now, checked, and continued, "I mean, this is one but do you know another one around here?". Then "Do you know when this closes", "Is this 24/7 walmart". I mean.. seriously dude! You think I am the best person to answer those questions for you - why? Best of all, he says he just moved here from Harrison (NJ) which is like 5 miles from the Walmart he was in!
Totally confused this guys, me thinks :)
Totally confused this guys, me thinks :)
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JA1HIND
02-13 07:37 AM
How about everyone who came up with this idea on this thread. Why should IV core or murthy or someone do this ?
Does any one on this forum happen to know an approximate dollar amount that would cost for if we (IV team) is planning to proceed further with this class action law suite on USCIS?? the reason I am asking for is if we have known dollar amount/target amount in hand it makes it easy for all to start contributing towards this target amount and proceed further with law suite.
I am sure someone on IV team would create a separate bucket for this specific class action law suite task and keep track of amount that's been collected...
Yes, I totally support this class action suite and also willing to support as mush as I can financially....
Does any one on this forum happen to know an approximate dollar amount that would cost for if we (IV team) is planning to proceed further with this class action law suite on USCIS?? the reason I am asking for is if we have known dollar amount/target amount in hand it makes it easy for all to start contributing towards this target amount and proceed further with law suite.
I am sure someone on IV team would create a separate bucket for this specific class action law suite task and keep track of amount that's been collected...
Yes, I totally support this class action suite and also willing to support as mush as I can financially....
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logiclife
06-26 08:16 PM
So "At the point of Approval" DOS can actually set/move/retrogress dates. Based on USCIS input. As USCIS is not able to handle this accurately, chances are that at a particular stage USCIS may alert DOS and DOS may retrogress dates - chances are there (though I personally feel this will not happen in July)
Which means what some of these lawyers are saying is not speculation but a definite possibility.
It doesnt say anywhere that they can change PDs in the middle of the month. What they are saying is that based on data collected from the "total number of files at point of approval" they can change PDs. But it doesnt say that they can change PDs in the middle of the month.
If anyone has a URL or source of information that shows the USCIS stopped accepting petitions in the middle of the month even when the dates were current, PLEASE POST THE URL OR SOURCE.
Otherwise this is bogus information coming out of certain law firms.
And this community is so scared that they have started seeing what they believe rather than believing what they see. The cynicism and psychosis has reached such alarming levels that people are seeing things even in Ombudsman report that dont exist.
Which means what some of these lawyers are saying is not speculation but a definite possibility.
It doesnt say anywhere that they can change PDs in the middle of the month. What they are saying is that based on data collected from the "total number of files at point of approval" they can change PDs. But it doesnt say that they can change PDs in the middle of the month.
If anyone has a URL or source of information that shows the USCIS stopped accepting petitions in the middle of the month even when the dates were current, PLEASE POST THE URL OR SOURCE.
Otherwise this is bogus information coming out of certain law firms.
And this community is so scared that they have started seeing what they believe rather than believing what they see. The cynicism and psychosis has reached such alarming levels that people are seeing things even in Ombudsman report that dont exist.
thepaew
12-13 04:46 PM
It will be a total waste of effort. Congress has exclusive purview to regulate relations, commerce, etc. with foreign nations. No lawyer/court can provide quick fix and the case will not be heard.
No shortcuts guys!! For any real change we have to convince the US Congress and the Executive Branch. And that involves time, commitment and money.
It will be a waste of money. The US does not have to allow any immigration if it chooses so. Do you realize that getting a GC is not a right, but a privelege? It's a matter of grace and no court has jurisdiction to review if government says "no".
No shortcuts guys!! For any real change we have to convince the US Congress and the Executive Branch. And that involves time, commitment and money.
It will be a waste of money. The US does not have to allow any immigration if it chooses so. Do you realize that getting a GC is not a right, but a privelege? It's a matter of grace and no court has jurisdiction to review if government says "no".
vivid_bharti
09-04 07:13 AM
India is still a country where 99% people would leave the country given a chance. Also leaving your country and be here as a 2nd grade citizens living your life like an asylee, don't know when you could be thrown out ? You are paying $2000 per year to US govt. to allow them to let us live in the country, we are beaten in Australia, we are beaten in middle east. But 1 thing in common, we don't want to live in India.
But even if you think Rajiv Gandhi or Indira gandhi did something they did only for 1% people.
We indian are fed with Gandhi family's name stamped on every grain and every drop that's why you are thinking you are alive because of the Gandhi family. Atal Bihari Vajpayee achieved what Rajiv Gandhi or Indira Gandhi did not achieved in 50 years of Gandhi family rule, but he didn't convert India into a Vajpayee country so you don't know the values. And by the way Rajiv Gandhi played most communal politics than any other PM did. He opened the gates of Ram Janma Bhoomi to douse the fire of Shah Bano case, he is responsible for awakening the Ayodhya Ghost All that I'm saying is why do you need to single out one politician. Can you compare YSR with Mr. Modi(Ghodra Express Issue), Mr Advani(Babri Mazdid Issue)...on how many innocent lives have been lost because of their filthy politics...
And mind you , you and me are working here in US cos of the open policies created by Mr.Late Rajiv Gandhi in the IT Sector. All that I'm saying is someone or something is better than none.
For that matter do you support War on Iraq , War on Afghanistan when it comes to people lives...
First know the facts before you comment and have guts to comment revealing your original ID and not with a hidden one....created just for the sake of it
But even if you think Rajiv Gandhi or Indira gandhi did something they did only for 1% people.
We indian are fed with Gandhi family's name stamped on every grain and every drop that's why you are thinking you are alive because of the Gandhi family. Atal Bihari Vajpayee achieved what Rajiv Gandhi or Indira Gandhi did not achieved in 50 years of Gandhi family rule, but he didn't convert India into a Vajpayee country so you don't know the values. And by the way Rajiv Gandhi played most communal politics than any other PM did. He opened the gates of Ram Janma Bhoomi to douse the fire of Shah Bano case, he is responsible for awakening the Ayodhya Ghost All that I'm saying is why do you need to single out one politician. Can you compare YSR with Mr. Modi(Ghodra Express Issue), Mr Advani(Babri Mazdid Issue)...on how many innocent lives have been lost because of their filthy politics...
And mind you , you and me are working here in US cos of the open policies created by Mr.Late Rajiv Gandhi in the IT Sector. All that I'm saying is someone or something is better than none.
For that matter do you support War on Iraq , War on Afghanistan when it comes to people lives...
First know the facts before you comment and have guts to comment revealing your original ID and not with a hidden one....created just for the sake of it
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